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chaoticangel97 Younin
Joined: 03 Sep 2009 Posts: 384
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Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 7:23 am Post subject: Narutod20 Pathfinder? |
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Wasn't sure where to put this, we've got a Pathfinder section now but this is still more a Narutod20 topic.
A friend put the idea in my head, but I wanted to get some opinions. Would it be possible to update Nd20 to Pathfinder without causing to many hiccups? I'm thinking I might give this a try as sort of a little project to work on in my spare time.
Now by updating I simply mean adjusting how skills, feats, saves and such work to match how Pathfinder handles them. Other things like classes wouldn't be changeable too much or one would need to completely rebuild the system.
Just a thought that was thrown my way and I wanted to hear some thoughts on it. |
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Felix_Zyphros Shinobigami
Joined: 06 Jun 2006 Posts: 1049 Location: Village Hidden in the Night
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Posted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:19 am Post subject: |
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Honestly? It's doable with houserules. A lot of the class stuff needs to be streamlined and put into something that actually fits a pattern, as opposed to "eh, I think this looks balanced". _________________ I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.
? Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear, Dune
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Reznor Kage
Joined: 20 Sep 2006 Posts: 235
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Posted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 8:10 am Post subject: |
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There's guides for converting 3.5 Material to Pathfinder. Use that.
I already do it with a few things (for example, Power Attack.) |
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Jensik Sharkbait
Joined: 17 Oct 2006 Posts: 1810 Location: The Internet
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Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:37 am Post subject: |
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Why in the nine hells would you choose Pathfinder's gimped ass Power Attack over 3.5's? You can dish out sooooo much more pain with ImpPA.
The only way I can see that being fair is you also allowed Furious Focus. _________________ Be careful when you follow the masses, because sometimes the 'm' is silent. |
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Frankto Shinobigami
Joined: 16 Aug 2004 Posts: 7372 Location: Canada
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Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:42 am Post subject: |
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You'd know, wouldn't you. -_- _________________ "It's like making a cake, but instead of a cake it's a game and instead of frosting I have no life."
1 - 2 - 3 - 4 - Java IRC Client
Thanks to all who donated! Your generosity is what keeps the project going! |
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Jensik Sharkbait
Joined: 17 Oct 2006 Posts: 1810 Location: The Internet
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Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 2:04 am Post subject: |
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Frankto wrote: | You'd know, wouldn't you. -_- |
Yes. Yes I would. _________________ Be careful when you follow the masses, because sometimes the 'm' is silent. |
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Reznor Kage
Joined: 20 Sep 2006 Posts: 235
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Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:47 am Post subject: |
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Jensik wrote: | Why in the nine hells would you choose Pathfinder's gimped ass Power Attack over 3.5's? You can dish out sooooo much more pain with ImpPA.
The only way I can see that being fair is you also allowed Furious Focus. |
I choose PF version as a DM, for the same reason that you apparently want 3.5's version.
It's alot more fair IMO and discourages the munchiney play-style that forces everyone in optimized builds.
Nearly unlimited To-hit -> damage trade option makes bonuses to damage hard to stay relevant, especially as more PA tree feats are taken. |
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Felix_Zyphros Shinobigami
Joined: 06 Jun 2006 Posts: 1049 Location: Village Hidden in the Night
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Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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Reznor wrote: | Jensik wrote: | Why in the nine hells would you choose Pathfinder's gimped ass Power Attack over 3.5's? You can dish out sooooo much more pain with ImpPA.
The only way I can see that being fair is you also allowed Furious Focus. |
I choose PF version as a DM, for the same reason that you apparently want 3.5's version.
It's alot more fair IMO and discourages the munchiney play-style that forces everyone in optimized builds.
Nearly unlimited To-hit -> damage trade option makes bonuses to damage hard to stay relevant, especially as more PA tree feats are taken. |
Do you limit summons to 1 per person? Do you ban Wish, Limited Wish, Miracle, and Divine Metamagic?
DnD by it's nature pushes people towards making optimized builds. Gimping melee'sts, who are already the weakest character option, just punishes your players for not wanting to play spellcasters. _________________ I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear.
I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.
? Bene Gesserit Litany Against Fear, Dune
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Frankto Shinobigami
Joined: 16 Aug 2004 Posts: 7372 Location: Canada
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Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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Felix_Zyphros wrote: | Gimping melee'sts, who are already the weakest character option, |
Hah! That's funny because it's really way, way off base. _________________ "It's like making a cake, but instead of a cake it's a game and instead of frosting I have no life."
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Thanks to all who donated! Your generosity is what keeps the project going! |
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cmkawasaki Lazy Programmer
Joined: 21 May 2005 Posts: 3388
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Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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Frankto wrote: | Felix_Zyphros wrote: | Gimping melee'sts, who are already the weakest character option, |
Hah! That's funny because it's really way, way off base. |
In Naruto D20, they are the strongest character option and probably easiest to Min-Max. This is due to a combination of both additional benefits (All Meleeists can be limited casters and therefore could do extra things), and more importantly, the loss of many important/frustrating defense mechanisms against melee attacks (Jutsus that use DR are rare, Jutsus that provide combat-total concealment are very rare to non-existent, and their primary replacements are usually limited to one technique a round against one attacker.).
This kind of stuff is also somewhat the same for Area-Effecters, but Evasive Manuevers and Evasion/Improved Evasion are much more useful here, as the Area-Attackers are bound by chakra limits, whereas meleeists really aren't. |
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Reznor Kage
Joined: 20 Sep 2006 Posts: 235
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Posted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 11:12 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | Do you limit summons to 1 per person? | No, but I did modify the mechanics so that one has to learn each summon individually (a la unique summons). Summon mechanics are fine to me.
Quote: |
Do you ban Wish, Limited Wish, Miracle, and Divine Metamagic?
| Never DMed a DnD adventure that went that far. (Which is a different game than what we are talking about.)
Quote: | DnD by it's nature pushes people towards making optimized builds. | But that's not a good thing.
It has too heavy of a shift on what builds are "good" and which ones are "bad"
Quote: | Gimping melee'sts, who are already the weakest character option, just punishes your players for not wanting to play spellcasters. | It doesn't gimp meleeist, it just cuts off a few crazy builds and makes it so that accuracy isn't the only thing worth investing in.
I'm sure this would terribly upset the table dynamic that you have, but it works just fine for the one that I want to have. I got over my powergamer phase a decade ago. |
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chaoticangel97 Younin
Joined: 03 Sep 2009 Posts: 384
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Posted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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well this turned into a different conversation than expected. |
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Reznor Kage
Joined: 20 Sep 2006 Posts: 235
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Posted: Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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We are still talking about a PF mechanic, just we camped out on Power Attack. |
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Dairius_Chi Situationally Useful
Joined: 02 Jun 2010 Posts: 2633
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Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 1:29 am Post subject: |
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I think the long and short of it all is: There exists a conversion for 3.X to Pathfinder, which would probably work for this- though not seamlessly. One thing Nd20 has that 3.0/3.5 lack is the Defense bonus, which became somewhat engrained into the whole system. Could it work without it? Yeah, but it would seriously shift how combat in general works.
A couple ways around this is to just carry it over as is, no modifications because a Pathfinder'd Nd20 wouldn't change much in the line of offensive capabilities. Medium and Heavy armor for PF are slightly better with their increased AC values, but that's just incentive to not have everyone running around in Mithral Chain Shirts.
Another option I'd thought on is simply borrowing 4E's 'everyone gets half their level as a defense bonus', I think that applied to touch and FF AC so it would fill the same slot as d20 Modern's without the idea that Fast Heroes are simply one of the best classes due to their huge Defense advantage. Maybe a separate talent tree could be made to boost that, I generally found the Deflect Tree kind of worthless when set beside other options.
I think the loss of the Mastercraft system could be a little shocking for most regular Nd20 players, since the idea of getting that extra 1-3 on attack rolls (or damage, but that's generally a second priority for my offense) or AC is much cheaper and easier to get ahold of. |
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Redfire085 Special Jounin
Joined: 08 Aug 2010 Posts: 111 Location: Texas
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Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2014 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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I recall posting the modern pathfinder website, it recently updated with rules for magic IIRC, including rules for changing the classic modern advanced classes (soldier, gunslinger, techie, etc.) into archetypes for the standard PF classes (soldier and gunslinger to fighter, techie to alchemist). Could use that as a basis for converting the Nd20 to PF rules? |
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